Base Audio Coding to HiFi

Torqu3 · 05-01-2018, 08:21 AM

I know. Another base audio upgrade question. I'm sorry.

My E90 has CIC iDrive, and I don't know if that causes problems when coding to HiFi.

I can't recall reading a thread that covered this case. The threads I saw were for people without CIC iDrive. Is it the same process as the massive thread by taibanl, or is there a thread specific to my scenario?

Thanks!

spud8385 · 05-01-2018, 09:00 AM

I've just put a post on the coding forum about this very thing:

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1491605

I too am having issues coding CIC to hifi, as all the info out there seems to be about professional head unit / CCC. I followed the normal instructions ie. add $676 to VO and sg_codieren affected modules, but couldn't find a module list for CIC (2RAD for professional head unit, CAPPL/CAUDI/CHOST/CGATE/CTUNE for CCC), tried just coding CIC but it did nothing, then just used the code whole car function which seems to have worked looking at my FSW_PSW.TRC but again, sounds no different at all.

Torqu3 · 05-01-2018, 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spud8385

I've just put a post on the coding forum about this very thing:

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1491605

I too am having issues coding CIC to hifi, as all the info out there seems to be about professional head unit / CCC. I followed the normal instructions ie. add $676 to VO and sg_codieren affected modules, but couldn't find a module list for CIC (2RAD for professional head unit, CAPPL/CAUDI/CHOST/CGATE/CTUNE for CCC), tried just coding CIC but it did nothing, then just used the code whole car function which seems to have worked looking at my FSW_PSW.TRC but again, sounds no different at all.

At least I'm not the only one with questions then. Thanks for the link to your thread! When you coded CIC to e92_hifi, did you get the option to change more tone settings in iDrive? I believe with base audio you get Treble and bass and that's it. Does HiFi get more adjustability through iDrive?

ctuna · 05-01-2018, 01:02 PM

You must have an ICOM cable to code anything on the Most
Bus I believe in cars after 3/07 . Idrive and all most modules.
See coding subforum and idrive subforum.
Look up 676 coding threads.

4 or 5 modules need to be coded with an idrive the
pro radio is only one.

spud8385 · 05-02-2018, 02:25 AM

Torqu3, I didn't get the option to change more tone settings no, just treble and bass still. However I think that's standard for base/hifi, I thought it was only HK that got a 7-band equaliser? Happy to be corrected here if someone knows better.

ctuna, I've done all my current coding with a K+DCAN, and the car is taking the changes as far as I can tell, it's just my audio output sounds no different. I've done a lot of searches for info about this and never seen anyone say an ICOM is required?

I know a lot of people recommend ICOM as being more stable, and also for pulling the 1b file to update maps (although I did this fine with the usb drive in glove box trick and an FSC generator), but I wasn't aware that it would make a difference here?

Emilime75 · 05-03-2018, 08:16 PM

I could be totally wrong here, but I thought the main difference between the base and HiFi systems was the addition of an external amp with HiFi, along with the speaker level outputs on the head unit being line level.

So, if it looks like the car is accepting the code changes, but audio is still playing as is... If your base to HiFi changes are working, you shouldn't hear any more audio without adding an amplifier and either buying an adapter harness or making your own.

Again, I could be totally wrong here.

ctuna · 05-03-2018, 10:01 PM

You should go from equalized speaker out at around 12 to 13 volts ac
to flat preout at 5 volts . You would still here something but it would be
less than half the output.

david in germany · 05-04-2018, 12:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Emilime75

I could be totally wrong here, but I thought the main difference between the base and HiFi systems was the addition of an external amp with HiFi, along with the speaker level outputs on the head unit being line level.

So, if it looks like the car is accepting the code changes, but audio is still playing as is... If your base to HiFi changes are working, you shouldn't hear any more audio without adding an amplifier and either buying an adapter harness or making your own.

Again, I could be totally wrong here.

The HiFi amplifier gets it's signal from the speaker wires, therefore, hifi or stereo coding will both have speaker wire signals out. If you code to TopHifi or M_individual you will loose speaker signal and the MOST ring will produce the output to the amplifier.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ctuna

You should go from equalized speaker out at around 12 to 13 volts ac
to flat preout at 5 volts . You would still here something but it would be
less than half the output.

Exactly!, but a much cleaner output signal to amplifiers because it removes the over boosting of the high and low frequencies.

ctuna · 05-04-2018, 12:36 AM

spud8385 · 05-04-2018, 08:17 AM

Emilime, I'm trying to recode after having the Alpine retrofit installed. And yes, looking at my TRC file post-coding, it seems to have taken. I added $676 to the VO and then coded the CIC, but after letting the car go into sleep mode it sounded no different, so I ended up doing Process Car > Code Car (which has changed about 300 parameters across all modules: https://docs.google.com/file/d/0BwgA...letype=msexcel) but again, it still sounds no different.

From all the comments I've seen about what a big difference the coding makes I was expecting more, but the treble is still very harsh, volume wasn't affected at all, and I also still have a fairly strong sound from the rear speakers, which if the HU was now outputting 5v signal I wouldn't have expected.

Torqu3, have you tried coding yours yet?

Torqu3 · 05-04-2018, 09:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spud8385

Emilime, I'm trying to recode after having the Alpine retrofit installed. And yes, looking at my TRC file post-coding, it seems to have taken. I added $676 to the VO and then coded the CIC, but after letting the car go into sleep mode it sounded no different, so I ended up doing Process Car > Code Car (which has changed about 300 parameters across all modules: https://docs.google.com/file/d/0BwgA...letype=msexcel) but again, it still sounds no different.

From all the comments I've seen about what a big difference the coding makes I was expecting more, but the treble is still very harsh, volume wasn't affected at all, and I also still have a fairly strong sound from the rear speakers, which if the HU was now outputting 5v signal I wouldn't have expected.

Torqu3, have you tried coding yours yet?

Not yet. It's sounding like I need to wait until I have amplified the system before coding.

ctuna · 05-04-2018, 12:25 PM

If you didn't here a reduction in sound pretty likely that
your coding did not take.
You don't want to do this till you have your new equipment ready
to go.
There was a way to go into the service menu for the idrive or pro radio and
read the setup.
Read the third link down for the entertainment pdf for instructions on accessing
the service menu.

bluewater328 · 05-07-2018, 12:59 AM

Got all the pieces and just about to dive in, but I wanted to ask one thing before I go beyond just INPA connection testing.

Suppossing I code the VO to $676 hifi (then follow with 2urad edits) and one day want to revert back to stock (base stereo), do I just remove the $676, or do I have to recode to another $xxx (that represents the Base/Stereo radio)? Or is it that base stereo is so base, its not a feature set? This is what I’m guessing since none of the walk thrus ever mention deleting the base stereo code before adding $676.

2urad files seem fairly self-evident.

spud8385 · 05-15-2018, 02:19 AM

Someone might know better than me, but as far as I know you just remove the $676 and code the affected modules again in Expertmode. I've never seen anyone discussing removing/adding an option code for base audio - I guess it's not technically an option, whereas Hifi/Top hifi are.

Let me know how you get on with your coding. I have put Logic 7 subs in mine which, after playing around with the equalizer, has transformed the sound in the car, so much so that I'm wondering if my coding DID take and just the music I was listening to combined with the 6.5" central bass crap under the seats was causing it to sound shit instead. I will attempt to code back to base stereo at some point and try to hear the difference but not in a massive rush.

bluewater328 · 05-18-2018, 04:59 AM

So just thought of the reverse in my initial failure to code, but given that i have the base stereo looking to go to hifi, when I do the VO, should I remove $663 before I add $676?

spud8385 · 05-18-2018, 11:57 AM

Isn’t 663 the headunit? Afaik head unit (business, professional, iDrive etc) are separate to the audio (base, 676 hifi, 677 HK etc) so don’t remove it?

bluewater328 · 05-19-2018, 03:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by spud8385

Isn’t 663 the headunit? Afaik head unit (business, professional, iDrive etc) are separate to the audio (base, 676 hifi, 677 HK etc) so don’t remove it?

I couldnt find a definitive answer but it seems you must be right in some respect. I will confirm later and check the VO again, but it never let me delete the feature — well, it initially let me delete but the final reset would never take.

EDIT: Confirmed that both $663 and $676 are on VO

So coding worked well and I now have a HiFi deck. I will say to those who are coding for Hifi, the sleep mode time is the most important part to allow it to take (which was maybe my mistake before).

I did the VO change, then SG_Coderien of the 2URAD then SG_Reset and turned off the car. Came back the next morning and had forgotten about it (since I had messed up and had failures previously). I realized the coding took when my PDC was about half the volume backing up. Immediately shut off the car and went to check the hidden menu by holding the “m” button to cofirm the HiFi status.

Also to confirm, my professional deck with BT/USB/Aux and Voice command had all features still working. Oddly, had to redo a few features like 3x turn signal and daytime running lights, but those are just done via the BC stalk. My previous velocity digital spedometer code was still intact.

Gongs were actually fairly intact with new settings but I raised them anyway for good measure. BT telephone connection was fine and my usb/aux is working (though soon to be replaced via the VX800/8i selectable input (along with a 4.0/5.0 Bluetooth audio receiver with a better DAC.

Now on to the install.

FOR REFERENCE (as I was always looking for this):
This was for a 2011 E90 328i LCI with base stereo. My stereo had been replaced due to the static/buzzing glitch. So I had a replacement deck with a 03/2011 build date (car was an 05/2010 build). Deck had the Sirius antenna pink connection (but I never activated it).

EDIT: Used NCS Expert installed on laptop with WinXP SP3 (non-emulation) with Bimmergeeks K-DCAN cable. Also think the BimmerGeeks software install was the simplist and most straightforward. They have two profiles which simplify things: Factory Coding and Manipulation which are their titled versions of version3 Expert Mode and MAN CSCoding, respectively. Updated with latest Daten.

ctuna · 05-19-2018, 11:30 AM

Did you use an Icom or k/d can cable?
I ask because there are many posts that say
and ICOM is necessary on cars past a certain build
date but I can find nowhere that states that build date.

bluewater328 · 05-19-2018, 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ctuna

Did you use an Icom or k/d can cable?
I ask because there are many posts that say
and ICOM is necessary on cars past a certain build
date but I can find nowhere that states that build date.

Damnit, I knew I forgot some details. I’ll edit above.

I used a Bimmergeeks K-DCAN cable. I saw the same things and was freaked out, but it obviously went well for me.

ctuna · 05-19-2018, 11:32 PM

Cool
I wish there was some statistics on this .
Even the bimmergeeks guy has suggested icom occasionally .

bluewater328 · 05-20-2018, 12:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ctuna

Cool
I wish there was some statistics on this .
Even the bimmergeeks guy has suggested icom occasionally .

I may have an anomaly because of the dealership radio swap out. But it also seems like the oddities are largely tied to CIC guys more than not (I could be wrong). I’m figuring there are a bunch of people like me running around screwing up hard data.

ctuna · 05-20-2018, 01:40 AM

There was a highly respected English coder that use to insist
the ICOM was needed for everything past a certain date .
I think it was a 3/7 build .

He use to pre program the usb / bluetooth version of the pro radio
and sell them .

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=704363

makkan00 was his handle.

Also there has been people that have reported they were
successful with the ICOM and not the K/D can may have been
nav idrive people.

05-01-2018, 08:21 AM	#1
Torqu3 Major 345 Rep 1,157 Posts Drives: 2011 335d Join Date: Sep 2016 Location: Centralish Texas iTrader: (0)	Base Audio Coding to HiFi I know. Another base audio upgrade question. I'm sorry. My E90 has CIC iDrive, and I don't know if that causes problems when coding to HiFi. I can't recall reading a thread that covered this case. The threads I saw were for people without CIC iDrive. Is it the same process as the massive thread by taibanl, or is there a thread specific to my scenario? Thanks!
	Appreciate 0 Tweet Quote

05-01-2018, 09:00 AM	#2
spud8385 New Member 4 Rep 29 Posts Drives: E92 LCI 325d M Sport Join Date: Mar 2018 Location: Southampton, UK iTrader: (0)	I've just put a post on the coding forum about this very thing: http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1491605 I too am having issues coding CIC to hifi, as all the info out there seems to be about professional head unit / CCC. I followed the normal instructions ie. add $676 to VO and sg_codieren affected modules, but couldn't find a module list for CIC (2RAD for professional head unit, CAPPL/CAUDI/CHOST/CGATE/CTUNE for CCC), tried just coding CIC but it did nothing, then just used the code whole car function which seems to have worked looking at my FSW_PSW.TRC but again, sounds no different at all.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

05-01-2018, 01:02 PM	#4
ctuna Lieutenant General 2430 Rep 14,049 Posts Drives: 325xi 06 wagon MT Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Santa Cruz, Ca iTrader: (0)	You must have an ICOM cable to code anything on the Most Bus I believe in cars after 3/07 . Idrive and all most modules. See coding subforum and idrive subforum. Look up 676 coding threads. 4 or 5 modules need to be coded with an idrive the pro radio is only one.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

05-02-2018, 02:25 AM	#5
spud8385 New Member 4 Rep 29 Posts Drives: E92 LCI 325d M Sport Join Date: Mar 2018 Location: Southampton, UK iTrader: (0)	Torqu3, I didn't get the option to change more tone settings no, just treble and bass still. However I think that's standard for base/hifi, I thought it was only HK that got a 7-band equaliser? Happy to be corrected here if someone knows better. ctuna, I've done all my current coding with a K+DCAN, and the car is taking the changes as far as I can tell, it's just my audio output sounds no different. I've done a lot of searches for info about this and never seen anyone say an ICOM is required? I know a lot of people recommend ICOM as being more stable, and also for pulling the 1b file to update maps (although I did this fine with the usb drive in glove box trick and an FSC generator), but I wasn't aware that it would make a difference here? Last edited by spud8385; 05-02-2018 at 02:26 AM.. Reason: grammar
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05-03-2018, 08:16 PM	#6
Emilime75 Colonel 1239 Rep 2,476 Posts Drives: 2010 335i E92 LeMans Blue Join Date: Dec 2017 Location: Merica! iTrader: (1)	I could be totally wrong here, but I thought the main difference between the base and HiFi systems was the addition of an external amp with HiFi, along with the speaker level outputs on the head unit being line level. So, if it looks like the car is accepting the code changes, but audio is still playing as is... If your base to HiFi changes are working, you shouldn't hear any more audio without adding an amplifier and either buying an adapter harness or making your own. Again, I could be totally wrong here.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

05-03-2018, 10:01 PM	#7
ctuna Lieutenant General 2430 Rep 14,049 Posts Drives: 325xi 06 wagon MT Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Santa Cruz, Ca iTrader: (0)	You should go from equalized speaker out at around 12 to 13 volts ac to flat preout at 5 volts . You would still here something but it would be less than half the output.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

05-04-2018, 12:36 AM	#9
ctuna Lieutenant General 2430 Rep 14,049 Posts Drives: 325xi 06 wagon MT Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Santa Cruz, Ca iTrader: (0)	BMW stereo types http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=352586 http://www.e90post.com/forums/attach...2&d=1266451970 http://www.e90post.com/forums/attach...2&d=1260829447 http://www.bmwmotorsports.org/pdf/e7...%20Systems.pdf http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=343673 http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=138949 http://www.e90post.com/forums/attach...1&d=1209780605 http://www.e90post.com/forums/attach...1&d=1209780865 http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=641323 http://bmwcoders.com/forum/3-er-8/bm...1-e92-e93-291/ http://technicpnp.com/menuDiagrams/d...e90_92_93.html http://www.musicarnw.com/page-2/ http://www.e90post.com/forums/attach...3&d=1169133185 http://www.e90post.com/forums/attach...4&d=1278871872 Base Stereo info (the ampless system) http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...ighlight=graph
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05-04-2018, 08:17 AM	#10
spud8385 New Member 4 Rep 29 Posts Drives: E92 LCI 325d M Sport Join Date: Mar 2018 Location: Southampton, UK iTrader: (0)	Emilime, I'm trying to recode after having the Alpine retrofit installed. And yes, looking at my TRC file post-coding, it seems to have taken. I added $676 to the VO and then coded the CIC, but after letting the car go into sleep mode it sounded no different, so I ended up doing Process Car > Code Car (which has changed about 300 parameters across all modules: https://docs.google.com/file/d/0BwgA...letype=msexcel) but again, it still sounds no different. From all the comments I've seen about what a big difference the coding makes I was expecting more, but the treble is still very harsh, volume wasn't affected at all, and I also still have a fairly strong sound from the rear speakers, which if the HU was now outputting 5v signal I wouldn't have expected. Torqu3, have you tried coding yours yet?
	Appreciate 0 Quote

05-04-2018, 12:25 PM	#12
ctuna Lieutenant General 2430 Rep 14,049 Posts Drives: 325xi 06 wagon MT Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Santa Cruz, Ca iTrader: (0)	If you didn't here a reduction in sound pretty likely that your coding did not take. You don't want to do this till you have your new equipment ready to go. There was a way to go into the service menu for the idrive or pro radio and read the setup. Read the third link down for the entertainment pdf for instructions on accessing the service menu.
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05-07-2018, 12:59 AM	#13
bluewater328 Colonel 655 Rep 2,098 Posts Drives: 2011 bluewater 328i LCI sedan Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Hawaii iTrader: (0)	Got all the pieces and just about to dive in, but I wanted to ask one thing before I go beyond just INPA connection testing. Suppossing I code the VO to $676 hifi (then follow with 2urad edits) and one day want to revert back to stock (base stereo), do I just remove the $676, or do I have to recode to another $xxx (that represents the Base/Stereo radio)? Or is it that base stereo is so base, its not a feature set? This is what I’m guessing since none of the walk thrus ever mention deleting the base stereo code before adding $676. 2urad files seem fairly self-evident.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

05-15-2018, 02:19 AM	#14
spud8385 New Member 4 Rep 29 Posts Drives: E92 LCI 325d M Sport Join Date: Mar 2018 Location: Southampton, UK iTrader: (0)	Someone might know better than me, but as far as I know you just remove the $676 and code the affected modules again in Expertmode. I've never seen anyone discussing removing/adding an option code for base audio - I guess it's not technically an option, whereas Hifi/Top hifi are. Let me know how you get on with your coding. I have put Logic 7 subs in mine which, after playing around with the equalizer, has transformed the sound in the car, so much so that I'm wondering if my coding DID take and just the music I was listening to combined with the 6.5" central bass crap under the seats was causing it to sound shit instead. I will attempt to code back to base stereo at some point and try to hear the difference but not in a massive rush.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

05-18-2018, 04:59 AM	#15
bluewater328 Colonel 655 Rep 2,098 Posts Drives: 2011 bluewater 328i LCI sedan Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Hawaii iTrader: (0)	So just thought of the reverse in my initial failure to code, but given that i have the base stereo looking to go to hifi, when I do the VO, should I remove $663 before I add $676?
	Appreciate 0 Quote

05-18-2018, 11:57 AM	#16
spud8385 New Member 4 Rep 29 Posts Drives: E92 LCI 325d M Sport Join Date: Mar 2018 Location: Southampton, UK iTrader: (0)	Isn’t 663 the headunit? Afaik head unit (business, professional, iDrive etc) are separate to the audio (base, 676 hifi, 677 HK etc) so don’t remove it?
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05-19-2018, 11:30 AM	#18
ctuna Lieutenant General 2430 Rep 14,049 Posts Drives: 325xi 06 wagon MT Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Santa Cruz, Ca iTrader: (0)	Did you use an Icom or k/d can cable? I ask because there are many posts that say and ICOM is necessary on cars past a certain build date but I can find nowhere that states that build date.
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05-19-2018, 11:32 PM	#20
ctuna Lieutenant General 2430 Rep 14,049 Posts Drives: 325xi 06 wagon MT Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Santa Cruz, Ca iTrader: (0)	Cool I wish there was some statistics on this . Even the bimmergeeks guy has suggested icom occasionally .
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05-20-2018, 01:40 AM	#22
ctuna Lieutenant General 2430 Rep 14,049 Posts Drives: 325xi 06 wagon MT Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Santa Cruz, Ca iTrader: (0)	There was a highly respected English coder that use to insist the ICOM was needed for everything past a certain date . I think it was a 3/7 build . He use to pre program the usb / bluetooth version of the pro radio and sell them . http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=704363 makkan00 was his handle. Also there has been people that have reported they were successful with the ICOM and not the K/D can may have been nav idrive people.
	Appreciate 0 Quote